Graham Chapter 6

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S.R. So, what you called with Tobias Rehberger and Jorge Pardo and so... - We call it "surface conceptual art", because you have only surface, not the philosophical meaning behind that. That could give us a reason to renew something like the aim of this philosophical art or reflective art. But anyway, the interesting thing is that, as you pointed it out, the main sources for you were popular culture, pop culture. For this new generations of so-called Conceptual art the sources are the Conceptual art books.

D.G. Other sources were mathematical topology. I think younger architects were interested in Frederick Kiesler. Kiesler was very important, also Oiticica. A lot of my conceptual pieces, like the video »Past features put attention« were very involved in the idea of a topological [?mobiestra] and about ideas of time, recent time, like a short time-delay or a more historical time. We were interested in everything. Nauman liked to go to lectures by Richard Feynman, a great physicist who gave lectures and also played the bongo drums. I think in the 60s we were interested in everything. What was good about art, the reason why we went into art – I wanted to be a writer – but the reason why we went into art is because in America you can be everything. If you are an artist, you can do film - Robert Morris did dance - you can do film, video, theatre, as well as objects. I think Nauman was a good example of a 60s-artist, whereas classic conceptual art seems to be too rigid and too dogmatic and programmatic.

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